In their effort to make themselves important, the leaders of the World Council of Churches occasionally come out with some very strange statements. Today, it has to do with North Korea, where General Secretary Sam Kobia has gone for some reason or another. The press release on the visit says:
In a recent meeting with a delegation from the World Council of Churches (WCC) visiting Pyongyang, North Korean president Kim Yong-nam said a significant impetus to solving the nuclear weapons stand-off in the region would be for North Korea and the U.S. to meet “face-to-face with each other”.
Kim is one of the three principal leaders of North Korea along with Kim Jong-il, the Supreme Leader, and Kim Yong-il, the Premier. Kim Yong-nam is often described as the de facto leader since he often represents the country on state visits around the world and in the signing of treaties on behalf of the DPRK. [Emphasis added.]
The only place Kim Yong-nam has ever been described as the de facto leader of North Korea is right here, in this press release, and he is so referred to because that makes the WCC delegation look more important, as if they had visited with the real leader of the country, rather than just a flunky who takes his marching orders from the Dear Leader, Kim Jong-il. Of course, it may be that the writer simply doesn’t know the difference between de jure (“in law”) as opposed to de facto (“in fact”), but that seems unlikely.
More from the release:
During his meeting with Kobia, Kim talked about how the North Korean government has assisted over the years in rebuilding churches that were destroyed during the Korean War and the bombing of Pyongyang by the U.S.
He invited the WCC to continue its relationship with the Korean Christian Federation through ongoing visits to the country.
There’s no indication that Kobia didn’t swallow this hook, line and sinker. The fact that the North Koreans have “rebuilt churches” says nothing about whether they are actually being used as churches, which is in a way beside the point. The fact is that North Korea persecution of Christians is among the world’s worst. Open Doors has ranked the DPRK as the worst offender among nations for seven years in a row. Voice of the Martyrs says “Government-organized religious activities exist solely to provide the illusion of religious freedom. North Korea is the worst perpetrator of persecution against Christians in the world….Christians must practice their faith in deep secrecy and are in constant danger, though many continue to stand strong under relentless persecution. The government considers Christians to be a stability threat, and they are hunted all over the country.” And yet there is nothing in the press release to indicate that Kobia expressed any concern whatsoever this continuing and pervasive persecution. Instead, all he seemed to want to talk about was Korean reunification and nuclear weapons:
Commenting further on the nuclear weapons situation of North Korea, Kim said the solution was to denuclearize the entire region. Creating a nuclear free Korean peninsula was “one of the last instructions from the Great Leader”, former North Korean leader Kim Il-sung, who is called the “eternal leader” of North Korea and died in 1994.
Kobia said the position of the WCC is that “those who have nuclear weapons should get rid of them and those wanting them should no longer seek them”.
A nice thought, until you realize who he’s dealing with: a regime that has repeatedly lied about the scope and even existence of its nuclear weapons program, one that continues to rattle sabers in the direction of South Korea and Japan, and one that has spent who knows how much money developing those weapons while millions of its own people starved to death. Put it all together, and I think one could easily conclude from this press release that 1) the WCC doesn’t care about Christians being persecuted, at least not by Communist dictatorships; 2) that it is extraordinarily naive when it comes to some of the world’s most evil people; and 3) that it has learned absolutely nothing from the prior damage to its reputation accrued from its previous record of glad-handing Marxist totalitarians.
In other news, the sun came up today…
October 21, 2009 at 2:20 pm
I think it is quite a stretch on your part to call it buddying up. I think both goals, disarmament and Korean unification, are quite worthy and I appreciate any attempt to achieve those goals.
Your selective march through all of history and current events looking for your justifications of your version is fascinating. I know we all do it but you did with gusto!
love, john + http://www.abundancetrek.com + We are intimately, intricately and infinitely connected by a matrix of unconditional, unlimited and uniting love which is miraculous, mysterious and marvelous.
October 21, 2009 at 2:25 pm
I meant to say “you do it with gusto!.”
October 21, 2009 at 8:55 pm
John: It is hard to take you seriously when you consistently refuse to come to grips with the content of the posts. What’s selective about my observations? What do I get wrong?
October 22, 2009 at 6:27 am
Nothing will stop the North Koreans except force.
October 22, 2009 at 10:52 am
David, I agree that I have not been specific up to this point. I tend to feel my way into my take on things and then eventually find the facts which support my position.
A really good read for you if you are interested in being open to a different take on things would be the book I suggested in a previous comment: SHOCK DOCTRINE by Naomi Klein. She thouroughly takes the Milton Friedman School of Thought to task revealing how they have over and over and over again used violence and repression to help the rich at the expense of the poor and the middle class. A good take on American history is Howard Zinn’s A PEOPLE’S HISTORY OF THE UNITED STATES.
I am simply suggesting that your take is based on a strong bias. I don’t dispute that my take is biased. Everyone has a bias. I see you constantly mocking and ridiculing those of us who have a different take and that’s what I’m trying to reveal to you.
On the topic of this post, I have a question for you: What do you think of Nixon going to China and meeting with Mao? It seems to me that dialogue with those who are on opposite sides politically is a good thing and can be very useful. Things are far from perfect in China but I don’t want to even think of what might have happened had we not begun to talk with the leaders of China.
Do you want to try to understand someone, a Presbyterian, who has a different take on history and current events than you do?
I will let go of this conversation if it begins to look like its not helpful to you or to me.
Thank you for listening.
love, john + http://www.abundancetrek.com + “The day will come when, after harnessing space, the winds, the tides and gravitation, we shall harness for God the energies of love. And on that day, for the second time in the history of the world, humankind will have discovered fire.” — Teilhard de Chardin
October 22, 2009 at 11:54 am
John: I appreciate your irenic tone, but I’m not sure how far we can go considering the sources you mention. Naomi Klein and Howard Zinn are not so much scholars (though Zinn is a historian) as far-left ideologues. Their counterparts on the right might be Pat Buchanan and David Irving. I wouldn’t give either of them the time of day, because while it’s true that all scholarship contains bias, their’s is so overwhelming that it renders any “scholarship” worthless. Klein and Zinn fall in the same category.
As far as bias goes, of course I have bias. Never denied it. I sometimes use humor to skewer those with whom I disagree, and sometimes resort to “mocking” and “ridiculing” because, frankly, that’s the only appropriate response from my perspective. I fail to see any of that in this post, however.
As for the Nixon/China analogy, that’s a good one, except that it fails to take into account two things: 1) Once our relations with China opened, we used the opportunity as a way to raise issues that the Chinese would rather have not talked about, i.e., human rights, Tibet, etc. We haven’t done so nearly consistently enough for my taste, but at least we’ve tried. 2) The WCC has been engaged with the North Koreans for 25 years, and have never raised issues such as human rights or the persecution of Christians with the leadership.
Talking to them about denuclearization and reunification is all fine and good, but let’s be realistic–the WCC isn’t going to be the catalyst to make either of those things happen, and in any case the WCC has no particular special insight into either issue that would make its contribution of any particular value. It may have a contribution to make on matters of human rights, and especially on persecution of Christians in North Korea, but chooses not to bring them up. Why? Because the North Koreans might stop talking to them about the other stuff? I’m not sure what the loss would be.
By the way, I should also mention that the WCC has no compunctions about speaking up regarding human rights, breaches of democracy, etc. when it wants to. For example, there’s a story on their Web site today about Honduras that you can find here. They may be right or wrong about the specifics, but I appreciate the fact that they see a human rights problem there and don’t hesitate to speak up. So why is Pyongyang, a far worse violator of human rights on any scale, not worth the same treatment?
October 22, 2009 at 3:56 pm
I really do appreciate that you took the time to take me seriously.
I don’t think any person who has thoroughly researched a book should be dismissed because you disagree with their ideology. I challenge you to read the 2 books I’ve mentioned and allow the possibility of seeing what’s happening on the planet in a different way. Both books are well researched. I’m sure there are other ways to look at the events they analyze but their analysis nevertheless should be taken seriously.
As a fan of the WCC, I found your very first sentence in this post and several others mocking and ridiculing. I’m not suggesting the WCC should not be critized. Of course it should be and maybe this is a good one to criticize. But your tone was condescending right from the start.
BTW, recently I borrowed an Ann Coulter book from the library and tried, really tried, to read it. But her attitude toward all who have a different take is so scornful that I simply had to put it down. So, maybe you could suggest a book or 2 which presents your side of the political divide with a reasonable amount of respect toward those on the other side.
I am very concerned that both sides are building higher and higher walls preventing basic communication and truth seeking. This is dangerous.
love, john + http://www.abundancetrek.com + “The spirit of liberty is the spirit of not being too sure you are right.” – Judge Learned Hand
October 27, 2009 at 11:24 am
[…] MARXIST CHRISTIAN IDIOTS Kobia Buddies up with North Korea; Mainliners Against Speech They Don’t Like …. […]